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	<title>Comments on: Prop 8 Redux: What now for marriage rights?</title>
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	<link>http://heathergold.com/show/conversation/prop8redux/</link>
	<description>The Heather Gold Show features bold conversations about politics, relationships and big life questions, mingling web innovators with the avant-garde. Featured guests include Flickr co-founder Caterina Fake, blogger Merlin Mann, and twitter founder Ev Williams, CorningWare inventor Sara Little Turnbull and comedian Maria Bamford (Comedy Central). boingboing calls her “one of our favorite comedians.”

http://twitter.com/tHGS
tag your questions and ideas from anywhere with #tHGS

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		<title>By: Equality Camp</title>
		<link>http://heathergold.com/show/conversation/prop8redux/comment-page-1/#comment-3760</link>
		<dc:creator>Equality Camp</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 27 May 2009 05:24:51 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://heathergold.com/show/?p=48#comment-3760</guid>
		<description>[...] than I about EQCA and the No on 8 committee groups. You can listen to the talk show I did on what went wrong with Prop 8. But EQCA has the same end goal as everyone else: winning. And it seems to have been learning from [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] than I about EQCA and the No on 8 committee groups. You can listen to the talk show I did on what went wrong with Prop 8. But EQCA has the same end goal as everyone else: winning. And it seems to have been learning from [...]</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Liminal states &#187; Stonewall 2.0: Repeal DOMA!</title>
		<link>http://heathergold.com/show/conversation/prop8redux/comment-page-1/#comment-2632</link>
		<dc:creator>Liminal states &#187; Stonewall 2.0: Repeal DOMA!</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 10 Jan 2009 21:34:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://heathergold.com/show/?p=48#comment-2632</guid>
		<description>[...] Obama, Speaker Pelosi (who&#8217;s also the Castro&#8217;s representative) and the new Congress.  Heather Gold talked about &#8220;we have the internet now &#8212; we don&#8217;t need to wait for big slow [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Obama, Speaker Pelosi (who&#8217;s also the Castro&#8217;s representative) and the new Congress.  Heather Gold talked about &#8220;we have the internet now &#8212; we don&#8217;t need to wait for big slow [...]</p>
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		<title>By: The First EqualityCamp in San Francisco</title>
		<link>http://heathergold.com/show/conversation/prop8redux/comment-page-1/#comment-2616</link>
		<dc:creator>The First EqualityCamp in San Francisco</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 30 Dec 2008 01:27:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://heathergold.com/show/?p=48#comment-2616</guid>
		<description>[...] after Prop 8 passed in California, a conversation on the Heather Gold Show about its passing prompted Heather and guest Tara Hunt of Citizen Space to gather several others [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] after Prop 8 passed in California, a conversation on the Heather Gold Show about its passing prompted Heather and guest Tara Hunt of Citizen Space to gather several others [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Heather Gold</title>
		<link>http://heathergold.com/show/conversation/prop8redux/comment-page-1/#comment-2602</link>
		<dc:creator>Heather Gold</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 15 Nov 2008 01:48:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://heathergold.com/show/?p=48#comment-2602</guid>
		<description>[...] the fresh recording, comment here, comment on twitter or anywhere else by tagging: [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] the fresh recording, comment here, comment on twitter or anywhere else by tagging: [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Hillary Hartley</title>
		<link>http://heathergold.com/show/conversation/prop8redux/comment-page-1/#comment-2601</link>
		<dc:creator>Hillary Hartley</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 12 Nov 2008 07:17:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://heathergold.com/show/?p=48#comment-2601</guid>
		<description>The following article should be required reading for Marriage Equality organizers and supporters:

&lt;a href=&quot;http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion/commentary/la-oe-cannick8-2008nov08,0,3669070.story&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;No-on-8&#039;s White Bias&lt;/a&gt;
By Jasmyne A. Cannick
November 8, 2008

No On 8 had no ground game.  None.  Not even if the parts of California where it was &quot;supposed&quot; to fail.

Jasmyne highlights the fact that not only do we have to pour our hearts into communities that may not exactly be friendly, we also have to re-frame the discussion.  I certainly think it&#039;s a civil rights issue, but will we be able to convince the necessary demographics of that?

The black-people-don&#039;t-think-this-is-a-civil-rights-issue is very similar to the religious-people-think-I&#039;m-disgusting-and-aberrant issue... not sure either is winnable.  So, what&#039;s the strategy?

Looking forward to discussing all this on Jan 10!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The following article should be required reading for Marriage Equality organizers and supporters:</p>
<p><a href="http://www.latimes.com/news/opinion/commentary/la-oe-cannick8-2008nov08,0,3669070.story" rel="nofollow">No-on-8&#8242;s White Bias</a><br />
By Jasmyne A. Cannick<br />
November 8, 2008</p>
<p>No On 8 had no ground game.  None.  Not even if the parts of California where it was &#8220;supposed&#8221; to fail.</p>
<p>Jasmyne highlights the fact that not only do we have to pour our hearts into communities that may not exactly be friendly, we also have to re-frame the discussion.  I certainly think it&#8217;s a civil rights issue, but will we be able to convince the necessary demographics of that?</p>
<p>The black-people-don&#8217;t-think-this-is-a-civil-rights-issue is very similar to the religious-people-think-I&#8217;m-disgusting-and-aberrant issue&#8230; not sure either is winnable.  So, what&#8217;s the strategy?</p>
<p>Looking forward to discussing all this on Jan 10!</p>
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		<title>By: Heather Gold</title>
		<link>http://heathergold.com/show/conversation/prop8redux/comment-page-1/#comment-2600</link>
		<dc:creator>Heather Gold</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 12 Nov 2008 06:25:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://heathergold.com/show/?p=48#comment-2600</guid>
		<description>What an amazing show..the longest one yet because no one wanted to end! 

This was by far the longest show ever. After we wrapped up the 90 min of Prop8 there was at least another hour of fun.  
  
We were remarkably thorough, hitting all the issues we wanted to cover and flowing  from analysis to conversation to play to action. 

Grassroots-based equality movement that will achieve the promise of this nation that &quot;no state shall ... deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws. Join us.

January 10th&gt; http://barcamp.org/EqualityCamp</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>What an amazing show..the longest one yet because no one wanted to end! </p>
<p>This was by far the longest show ever. After we wrapped up the 90 min of Prop8 there was at least another hour of fun.  </p>
<p>We were remarkably thorough, hitting all the issues we wanted to cover and flowing  from analysis to conversation to play to action. </p>
<p>Grassroots-based equality movement that will achieve the promise of this nation that &#8220;no state shall &#8230; deny to any person within its jurisdiction the equal protection of the laws. Join us.</p>
<p>January 10th> <a href="http://barcamp.org/EqualityCamp" rel="nofollow">http://barcamp.org/EqualityCamp</a></p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Rick Fisk</title>
		<link>http://heathergold.com/show/conversation/prop8redux/comment-page-1/#comment-2599</link>
		<dc:creator>Rick Fisk</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 12 Nov 2008 04:54:55 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://heathergold.com/show/?p=48#comment-2599</guid>
		<description>I think that the &quot;left&quot;,  consisting of many who are in favor of this mob rule initiative nonsense - until goes against them - needs to start acknowledging that rights are not granted by government.

Marriage and Contract are specifically removed from State purview for two reasons.

1. &quot;Marriage&quot; is a religious ceremony. When a state interferes with that, it is violating a fundamental right of the people to engage in worship.

2. A contract between two individuals is the most protected institution listed in the Federal Constitution. 

It states &quot;No State Shall make any law..... impairing the obligation of contract.&quot;

So, if any people engage in a contract, the state may not interfere in that contract unless the terms of the contract perpetuate fraud. This is why laws against bigamy are essentially unconstitutional UNLESS the extra wives or husbands are the subject of fraud.

What the &quot;gay rights&quot; activists want, is for people to recognize their contracts. But this makes no sense since the only parties to the contract are those who agreed to its terms. Thus there is no legal basis to demand that the contract extend to others.

We *should* abolish the State&#039;s insistence on issuing marriage licenses and performing religious ceremonies. And believe me, they in fact open up a Bible in the judge&#039;s chambers and perform the marriage ceremony.

Every individual is born with the same rights. There are no &quot;special&quot; rights needed to correct past discrimination. 

Discrimination is itself a fundamental right. With every right, one has to accept the good with the bad. The left often wants to abolish the bad part of some right (and in some cases all of it ie; self-defense) but does not want to acknowledge the positive results of the right in action.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think that the &#8220;left&#8221;,  consisting of many who are in favor of this mob rule initiative nonsense &#8211; until goes against them &#8211; needs to start acknowledging that rights are not granted by government.</p>
<p>Marriage and Contract are specifically removed from State purview for two reasons.</p>
<p>1. &#8220;Marriage&#8221; is a religious ceremony. When a state interferes with that, it is violating a fundamental right of the people to engage in worship.</p>
<p>2. A contract between two individuals is the most protected institution listed in the Federal Constitution. </p>
<p>It states &#8220;No State Shall make any law&#8230;.. impairing the obligation of contract.&#8221;</p>
<p>So, if any people engage in a contract, the state may not interfere in that contract unless the terms of the contract perpetuate fraud. This is why laws against bigamy are essentially unconstitutional UNLESS the extra wives or husbands are the subject of fraud.</p>
<p>What the &#8220;gay rights&#8221; activists want, is for people to recognize their contracts. But this makes no sense since the only parties to the contract are those who agreed to its terms. Thus there is no legal basis to demand that the contract extend to others.</p>
<p>We *should* abolish the State&#8217;s insistence on issuing marriage licenses and performing religious ceremonies. And believe me, they in fact open up a Bible in the judge&#8217;s chambers and perform the marriage ceremony.</p>
<p>Every individual is born with the same rights. There are no &#8220;special&#8221; rights needed to correct past discrimination. </p>
<p>Discrimination is itself a fundamental right. With every right, one has to accept the good with the bad. The left often wants to abolish the bad part of some right (and in some cases all of it ie; self-defense) but does not want to acknowledge the positive results of the right in action.</p>
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